The Impact of New Shoreline Setbacks to Oceanfront Property Owners with Kris Eiserloh

Interview Transcription

ADRIENNE: 
Welcome back. And thanks for listening to the Team Lally Real Estate show home of the guaranteed sold program or we’ll buy it. I’m Adrienne, and I’m still Attilio. And if you have any questions, just give us a call at 7999596. Or check us out online at Teamlally.com.

ATTILIO: 
By the way, I just want to remind our listeners if you want to get a value on your home, we just added this to the front page of our website Teamlally.com. What is your home worth? You don’t be talking to no pesky agents takes about two three minutes. punch your information in hit the send button boom.

ADRIENNE: 
And you could also get a instant offer as well. Yeah, take a look at that there.

ATTILIO: 
At any price point you got a $10 million home if the numbers make sense, we’ll write you an offer you move we’ll take care of the rest 14 Day closed. 14 day closed. Our guest today grew up in San Francisco and earned an architectural degree from the College of Environmental Design at UC Berkeley. In 1986. He moved to Honolulu upon graduation and began his apprenticeship gaining experience in masterplanning luxury residential and resort design.

ADRIENNE: 
He has lived in East Oahu for the past 37 years and is married with four children. His firm was opened in 1991 with the idea to take on a limited number of projects so that he can be personally involved in every design from start to finish. Please welcome our guest, Kris Eiserloh. Kris, welcome. Welcome to the radio show.

KRIS: 
Oh, thank you for having me. It’s a pleasure.

ATTILIO: 
Yeah. All right. So let’s go ahead, Adrienne.

ADRIENNE: 
Well, I just wanted to share with our listeners how we got connected to Kris. Yeah. So we had sent out a video marketing on our $25 million estates. And somehow Kris is on our mailing list. And he responded with some like coming from contribution, he gave us some information that’s happening with the shoreline and some different things that we need to be aware of as well as our clients that may have oceanfront properties. And just the information that he shared, I thought, wow, like we need to get the word out effectively, and also, you know, provide some solutions to these people that are affected by these changes coming up.

ATTILIO:
Gotcha. All right. So let’s talk about the new shoreline setbacks and get good straight away to it. What’s What’s that all about?

KRIS: 
Yeah, so in the last few months, the city council has passed a resolution it’s Bill 41. That will increase the shoreline setback from what’s the current setback of 40 feet to 60 feet plus a 70 times the erosion rate of the shoreline. And you know, if the shoreline erosion is let’s say, you know, an inch or two inches a year, you’re looking at an additional 70 inches 240 inches, and they actually have a maximum setback of 135 feet. So that kind of gives you the idea that some of the properties on the shoreline will not be able to build anything except for they do offer a minimum 1500 square foot footprint that they will give certain properties. Now, this law applies Island wide, but in the Honolulu core or the city core 60 foot will be the setback but they’re calling hardened shoreline. However, this law comes to into effect July 2024. And will affect everybody. It’ll affect people that already how The properties in our structures inside the 40 foot setback, as well as those that have from 40 to 60 feet, there will be new laws that are restricting new construction or rebuilding of the construction, I should say, as a percentage based of the value of the structure, but it’s coming, and everybody is going to feel the effects of it. Whether they like to or not. Yeah.

ADRIENNE:
So Kris, we were talking about this earlier, I think you had done some testimony about this with like, for example, homes that are, you know, considered shoreline, but it’s there on like a very tall cliff, compared to homes that are on a more of a sandy beach. So we’ll talk about that.

KRIS: 
Yeah, so like I said, the law will apply to everybody irregardless of where they’re located. So you’ll have a minimum of 60 feet. So if your house is sitting on a, or if the property is on a on a on a cliff, it still will have a 60 foot setback on on it. And so yeah, so So whether it’s a beach, a cliff, on the leeward side, Windward side, no matter where on the island, the minimum setback is 60 feet.

ATTILIO:
Yeah, I’m thinking like places like Portlock, you know, you got all those spinning caves is, is an example. You got all those homes over there. And they’re all on those flip sides. And

ADRIENNE: 
so So what’s gonna happen with those? He said something about them being non conforming, so they get the exception. Yeah. But then we had talked about, like the permits, having to get those in and be approved.

ATTILIO: 
Yeah, yeah. So

KRIS: 
my recommendation is that anybody that’s thinking about building anything in the future, or even if they’re not thinking about it, but want to keep the value of their property, they should go in immediately to try to get a building permit, as long as you submit your building permit before July 2024, you will be, quote grandfathered in. However, you do have to go through an SMA permit, which may take six to nine months. And so there’s not a lot of time to actually then submit for the building permit. But it’s a window that’s closing, but anyone that wants to keep value or maintain value or actually add value to their property, they really need to go in and get go for a building permit.

ATTILIO: 
Well, we’re one year out. We’re in the month of July, do you think people would have enough time for the end? By the way, SMA stands for Special Management Area, and then doing the regular permit? Do people have time within this 12 month period?

KRIS: 
You know, it were it’s going to be very, very close. Yeah, to get the permit, but I think there’s there is still time, but they do have to start almost immediately. There are ways that they can go for an SMA minor permit rather than a major. And that has to do with the construction value of the structure they’re trying to build anything under $500,000 will qualify for an SMA minor, and those can be processed much faster than an SMA major. So there are strategies if to go for your permits. If you want to build something more than $500,000 it might be better to start off with an SMA minor permit and then add for an apply for an SMA major after you’ve already got a building permit for the work that you want to do.

ADRIENNE: 
So Kris, with these SMA permits, whether they’re minor or major, what kind of investment are we looking at here to get these done?

KRIS:
Yeah, so for an SMA minor permit, you’re you’re looking at, of course, architectural and engineering fees that that would be required for that project. And then in addition to those, you’d have to think of the softer costs of soils engineer, topographic survey, shoreline certification, it’s not going to be inexpensive. You’re probably looking at a minimum of 50,000 for the minor. You’re, you’re probably looking at 150,000 for the major. As a minimum that doesn’t include if you’re you know, if you’re building a multimillion dollar house, you know, the architectural fees are averaged about 10% of construction cost. So but but the planning permit for the SMA permit itself is going to add to it about $100,000 for an SMA major and may be only 20,000 for an SMA minor.

ATTILIO: 
Now, Kris, it sounds like you got a lot you know a lot about these oceanfront properties. Tell us about your experience with oceanfront projects.

KRIS: 
Yeah, so I’ve been working on oceanfront properties since 1987. And have probably done about 20 Plus projects throughout the island, all the way from, you know, Portlock to the North Shore, Aiea, Kailua. Pretty much all over the island. And that’s how I’ve become so interested in these new laws, they’re gonna really affect people significantly. Yeah. And, yeah, and I just want to make sure that they all know that there is a solution, and they still have time to do something, you know, to save the value of their property.

ADRIENNE:
So Kris, if our listeners, you know, fit into this category needing these special permits to preserve their, the value of their property, is this something that that your firm can assist with?

KRIS:
Yes, our firm specializes in architectural services, but we work with consultants that that work with the SMA permit. So the first thing that you would need to do is kind of get a conceptual design that we can provide. And then I would work directly with you to permit the SMA project or I should say, the estimate permit. And that’s usually through a planning firm.

ATTILIO: 
And you’re not one of these professors at the College of Architecture, do h Manoa. You actually have you have ongoing projects like right now, right?

KRIS:
I do I do. I just received an SMA permit approval for one project. And I have two additional projects that are in that permit process right now. These these projects were submitted several months before the new law came in was actually passed. These are just projects that were going on going projects that weren’t really considering the new law. And so we were able to sneak in in the window of the new law.

ATTILIO: 
Well, I think the person that’s we’re tickling their brain right now is one the ocean front owner, that’s, hey, you know, I think I might do some remodeling, maybe some refurbishing,

ADRIENNE:
or I might want to be selling in the next several years. Well,

ATTILIO:
and now it’s giddy up time. And then the other listener, we might be tickling their mind with would be the potential buyers out there. That is buying an oceanfront property, maybe the obviously this is going to be something to consider when and remind the the listeners when is this law, supposedly going to take effect?

KRIS: 
Yeah, so the law has been signed, and it has been signed into law. And it goes into effect July 2024. The other I guess, owners that really would be affected the most, I think, are people that have vacant land, or people that have houses that are ready to be torn down those particular people, and like you said, people that might be interested in buying or selling in the future, if you’re selling if you’re going to sell you should really try to get this permit in place. So the future buyer can take advantage of that permit.

ATTILIO: 
Yeah, because I think this is you know, for you realtors out there. We’re reminding ourselves now and we’re going to go ahead. And by the way, if you go and punch in your information on our website, Teamlally.com What’s your home’s worth? There is not going to be a location in there for you no SMAs. And

ADRIENNE: 
actually, it would be under like the very last thing. No, no, I have a SMA major, which actually would, you know, according to our conversation here with Kris, it does significantly increase the value of what you do with your property. So Kris, if you know if someone misses this opportunity, let’s fast forward to next year 2024 August, and they haven’t done this these SMA permits. What can you do? Yeah, what can be the ramifications of under non

ATTILIO: 
conforming? Yes.

KRIS: 
Yeah. Well, I think if they miss this opportunity, you know, they’re gonna lose 20 feet of ocean front. lineal feet of ocean front property to build in, and that’s significant in an ocean front property because most properties aren’t, you know, 60,000 square feet or 40,000 square feet. And they don’t have a lot of length to them. So you could potentially be the only allowed to build a very small house Oh, that’s kind of pigeon holed between your neighbors, that you kind of have a tunnel vision of their properties. And that’s going to be the Yeah.

ATTILIO: 
Give people the visual your property is going to be have to be scooted all the way back away from the ocean, and then your neighbor on your left and right, that did it or, you know, have the permits, they’re gonna be closer to the ocean with the existing

ADRIENNE: 
property, though. Like, let’s say they don’t have the money to do this SMA permit. Yeah. And then maybe like 5-10 years from now, they got to do some renovations to the home, they’re not going to be allowed to make those renovations if permits required if a permit is required, if it’s within that, that setback. Does that does that? Well, we understand it?

KRIS: 
Well, no, they there is a provision that says they will be able to do some renovations to the home. But it would only be a certain percentage of the value of the home over a 10 year period. So in other words, you can’t rebuild the home. They say 70% of the value for most properties. And it doesn’t it sounds like a lot, but it really isn’t by the time you end up doing the renovation. And then remember, that’s over a 10 year period. Yeah. So yeah. Well as provisions.

ATTILIO: 
Yeah, I think it’s gonna keep people on top of their toes, because you’re gonna have to stay on top of the maintenance, to not end up doing major renovations.

KRIS: 
The other thing to note, though, the more is that they’re not going to be able to build into that 40 up to the 40 foot setback in the future at all.

ATTILIO: 
Yeah. And then because now we’re going and then we’re so we’re going from 40 and help people understand the lay person? Where do we start the measure? Where’s the starting point of that measurement of the setback?

KRIS: 
The starting point is at the shoreline of the certified shoreline. And that’s, that’s a line set by the state. And it usually follows the vegetation line, it’s actually called the wash the waves. Yeah, so there could be it all depends on how the state designates that line. Sometimes. It’s, it’s the vegetation line, whereas other times, you can see leaves or debris further inland. And they’ll mark that as your certified shoreline.

ATTILIO: 
Gotcha. So that’s why people are going out at one in the morning planting naupaka.

KRIS: 
All right. Well, you know, it’s interesting now that it’s hurricane season, the state is not supposed to look at the wash of the waves as high to a hurricane or some other event like a tsunami. However, that’s not guaranteed, they might just look at that and reduce the shoreline. But that’s another subject. But it’s about it’s 40 feet from about the vegetation line, if you could kind of look at it

ATTILIO: 
that well, what you mean, again, for the lay people, if you’re having that checked out by the state, and you’re on the North Shore, you want them to do that in the summertime. And if you’re on the other side of the island, you want them to do that during the wintertime where they so just think of it this way when you’re on the opposite side of the swell. Yes, North Shore wintertime. It’s crazy. Flip flop it so So

ADRIENNE: 
on that note, like, let’s talk about the different areas like what area of the island, do you think is going to have the most challenges with this news? New

ATTILIO:
setback? Yeah.

KRIS:
Yeah, so Honolulu is an area that whole coast is really being affected by the short of a wave action, it’s that side, of course, we know about the north shore where there’s certain pockets of the North Shore that are really being severely impacted. But then there’s also the Ewa side, and Waianae and Makaha those areas are also being severely impacted and certain in certain areas. So I would say that if you’re out in the, quote the country away from the Honolulu core, that those areas are going to be severely impacted the most, because that’s where they’re going to include the erosion factor 70 times the erosion. And I think that some of the lot, some of the properties are going to be, quote unbuildable the setbacks gonna completely overtake the property, but they will allow you a 1500 foot footprint to build your house and so that’s kind of a that’s not much you know, when you think about the footprint doesn’t mean that You could have 100% of the building in it.

ATTILIO: 
That’s like when you go Cheesecake Factory, they have the regular menu, and then they have the skinny menu to go with the skinny menu for your house on 1500 square feet. That’s a small footprint.

KRIS: 
Yeah, and especially if you have to park a couple of cars in that area. Yeah, that really reduces your buildable area.

ATTILIO: 
Gotcha. You’re gonna have a skinny house with electric bikes, and then you gotta go catch the bus. But the, you said something else to expand upon that are explained to us in layman’s terms. 70 times the erosion.

KRIS: 
Yeah, so they’ve used this erosion factor. And what they’ve done is they have satellite maps, where they see where the beach was five years ago, and where it is today. And in most areas, it’s, you know, receded. Right? And so they can measure it down to the inch. And they do so. And they multiply that factor per year, by 70 times. Oh, and in some cases, you’re looking at over a foot difference, you know, some of the areas like the North Shore like Punaluu, like some of these other areas, they have, they might have six inches of erosion. You know, that’s huge. You know, 70 times six is 420 inches. Yeah, right. What’s your 60 feet? So we’re really talking about? Yeah,

ATTILIO: 
you know, I, if you go out to Holly Eva, some of the shops there have old photos from like the 1800s 1900s. And I saw a photo, I think it was about 1910 1920 of Waimea Bay. So, Kris, I know you’ve been out there tons of times, and you jump off the big rock into the ocean, you know, a big rock, I’m talking about that all the kids. Absolutely. That ocean, that rock was on the beach. In this photo, the shoreline went past the rock. So if you jumped off of that you were broke both your legs because you were hitting the sand. Fast forward to today, you can go on Tiktok. In January of this year, I was I was on the it was on YouTube on a shore, there was a big wave that came all the way past that rock all the way up to the cliff sides, and was watching all these tourists who had other stuff. That’s how big the waves are. And I’m born and raised here. I was telling Adrienne, I’ve never seen the waves come in that far at Waimea Bay. So things are changing.

KRIS: 
They are they are the city is using a 3.1 foot 3.2 foot Excuse me. Sea level rise as kind of the basis for making these new rules. Yeah, and so they’re predicting that there’ll be a 3.2 sea level rise by the year 2100. Whether or not that’s true, nobody knows. It could be set up to seven feet as some someone’s predicted and it could be as low as 18 inches. And so I don’t know if I’ll be around.

ATTILIO: 
Hey, vegetables,

ADRIENNE: 
so my vegetables. So Kris, you know, we’re talking about getting these SMA permits and you know, being able to make the renovations. Now what if you’re a homeowner and you decide like, hey, this my home is it’s just too close to the ocean? I’m nervous. How hard is it to physically move that house back by 20? To 40? Feet? Yes. You have the space? Yeah, if they have the space? Do you have plans to help people do that?

KRIS: 
Yeah. Well, that that is quite difficult. I mean, ideally, if their houses on a post and pier type of construction, it would be a lot simpler if they want if they’re worried about being too close to the ocean, and there are certain cases that I’ve seen in then, like the certain areas of the island that look like the oceans come in. My recommendation is to raise the house up higher kind of on on on big concrete piers. So if the water does come in flood through, it won’t, you know flood the house? I know

ATTILIO: 
to a better solution. You can get a site’s what is it? Elevations elevations certificate that brings your insurance down if you do that, but yeah, it’s not like in the old days. I mean, I remember growing up here and people would buy the plantation, tongue and groove posts and pier homes. They would buy them and then move them because I remember they would go late at night and be driving down the road, both sides of the lane, the police, and people used to do that, but I don’t I don’t think it’s worth it for people do that nowadays. So

KRIS: 
yeah, those homes have seen better days. Yeah. Most of

ATTILIO: 
So, so if your home is made of Legos, this could work for you. But it’s gonna be pretty expensive project. If your home is not made of Legos,

ADRIENNE: 
I think that the important message is to reach out to Kris and his team and get educated, get educated figure out what is the best strategy for you. And your particular situation with your house and your budget and the future plan.

ATTILIO: 
Yeah, Kris, what’s a good number for you?

KRIS: 
808-777-9968

ATTILIO: 
you know what? People were scrambling for the pens. Tell us the number one more time.

KRIS:
Yeah, so it’s 808-777-9968.

ATTILIO: 
All right. Well, thank

ADRIENNE: 
you, Kris, so much for being on the show and educating our listeners. And, you know, we appreciate

ATTILIO: 
you, I think we’re gonna have to have you on six months from now. And then another six months from now is gonna be like the shoreline setback countdown. Yeah, the update, right? Yeah.

KRIS: 
Well, thank you so much for having me. And if I can be a further assistance, please reach out to me. I’ll be available. Anytime. Yeah,

ADRIENNE: 
thank you, Kris.

ATTILIO: 
Thank you, Kris. Okay. All right. So folks, he gives you a free consultation. The worst thing is not knowing what you don’t know. Give him a call, get educated on that situation, if you’re in it or thinking about getting into oceanfront properties and give us a call.

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