Estate Planning & Special Needs Care with Amphay Champathong

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Interview Transcription

ADRIENNE:
Welcome back. And thanks for listening to the Team Lally real estate show home of the guaranteed sold program. We’ll buy it. I’m

ATTILIO:
Adrienne, and I just opened to Celsius. And who are you? And I’m gonna tell you, if

ADRIENNE:
you have any questions, you can reach us at 7999596. Or check us out online at Team lally.com.

ATTILIO:
I was wondering you know radio show can you like say you’re like jokingly say you’re sponsored by a company, but it’s not for real? And then would you get in trouble? Probably not because you give them free? Free advertising. Like I don’t understand, like when the when the people are doing the shows on the TV, and they’re like blurring out all the stuff products. I think like, I mean, if it was like profanity, yes, blurred out or something like Not, not nice. But if they had a Pepsi shirt, what the heck? Who cares if they go on Pepsi shirt on? Anyway, today’s show is brought to you by Celsius. It’s America’s number one energy drink with only 200 milligrams of caffeine.

ADRIENNE:
And what’s that? How many of us have you drinking today? Oh,

ATTILIO:
I think I’m drinking three of these today. So that’s the equivalent of 16 cups of coffee

ADRIENNE:
to stop it. So we do have, we do have one, we’ve got a special person that’s actually in the studio. My mom, your mom, my mom,

ATTILIO:
you know, talk the talk about this. You always say this the same story, and I want your mom to hear it. So she knows that she does know she’s heard this. She knows the story. But let’s all Let’s all say it right now. What were your thoughts about joining real estate in the beginning? You were raised in a real estate house? No, thank you. I’m gonna join the army. And it was good. It wasn’t because of your mom, because you’re my expert then. And she’s still and she’s even more of an expert today. Because of why?

ADRIENNE:
Oh, I just watched how she worked so hard and to some really terrible people that she had to deal with. Yeah. And I was like, I don’t want to deal with those kinds of other agents in those situations. And it just did not seem very appealing to me at all.

ATTILIO:
And then you grew up became an adult and you realize jerks are everywhere. It doesn’t matter what you do. Well,

ADRIENNE:
it seems like there’s less jerks in Hawaii. So I just I enjoy doing real estate here. I don’t know that I could do it in the mainland like she’s done for 40 plus years. Yeah. So that’s, you know, hats off to her. So she’s here in the studio. And

ATTILIO:
because, you know, I was in New York and they’re like, hey, honk your horn more. This is not hold I got another bumper sticker. Ah, yelling screaming at each other more often this ain’t Hawaii. No, we have that here where we always say don’t honk your horn slow down. This is not the mainland.

ADRIENNE:
And, you know, a funny story is that, you know, my mom and I, we were talking about Amphay. Just this last weekend. Yeah. And I was like, oh, you should have mommy up. Listen to Amphay show. He always provides excellent information about estate planning. Yes. And I know a lot of people don’t understand that they think, Oh, I have a will. That’s fine. I don’t need a trust, like everything’s all listed out in the will and you know, then it causes problems and then you’re going to probate. Yeah. So I’m excited that my mom is here and she probably has some questions for Amphay well,

ATTILIO:
by the way, so I want to tee it up for you with a visual for our next guest this Amphay I think this should be your commercial you panning slowly drawn shot coming in tighter tighter tighter to a funeral at a semi local cemetery. And all the relatives all getting all nuts on each other and beefing and fighting over grandma’s wedding ring, pan out. As he comes in driving in with a white car and he steps out of the car you hear harps and everything and everybody gets calm and peaceful. And Amphay’s like I have a plan for you all. Not to worry, you guys need to relax. Anyway,

ADRIENNE:
what do we want to read Amphay’s intro though? Is it who this expert that is okay, so Amphay arrived in Hawaii with his family as refugees from Laos after spending a couple years in a refugee camp. He grew up in Kalihi. He attended Kalani High School and went on to complete his college education at University of Hawaii.

ATTILIO:
He holds a BA in sociology, a master’s in social work, and a Juris or

ADRIENNE:
William S. Richardson School of Law. As

ATTILIO:
a member of the Hawaii State Bar Association. He practices in estate planning and serves as a guardian ad litem making significant contributions to our community. Please welcome to our guest. Amphay Champathong. Amphay did I say you guys

ADRIENNE:
say your last name and then my my mom is here. Her name is Myra. Myra,

ATTILIO:
let’s say your last name again. Amphay.

AMPHAY:
She get that?

ATTILIO:
Well, you know, he cut out it was so powerful that it cut out but keep going. You know what, we’re gonna hit you with some questions. Yeah, so introduce your mom in this. Yeah.

ADRIENNE:
So I know that we’re gonna I know we’re gonna talk about special needs planning. But before we do that, my mom is here. Her name is Myra Beams and say Hello, ma’am. Hi, Amphay. How are you? Hi, Auntie Myra.

ATTILIO:
Hey, my real quick. How long? Have you been in the business?

MYRA:
Since 1983? Oh, wow.

ATTILIO:
1983. And you’re still a practicing? What was the practicing? You are a realtor, you’re doing it not practicing anymore. And so that’s a long time. And then how much of a pain in the butt was Adrian when she was a child in your knowledge? Can you I can’t say that will be that’ll be in the documentary The Docu series. Adrienne, the so let’s talk about you. Not only do you so let’s talk about mommy up in that situation. Tell us about that. Well,

MYRA:
my mother is quite elderly. And I’ve been trying to talk to her for years about setting up a trust so that there nothing is left unturned when when the time comes. And she thinks it’s quite her will is quite sufficient. I’ve tried to explain to her about about the probate issues. Because if you have a will you’re gonna go to probate. Yeah, yeah. And if you have a trust, just skip it. You just skip that. And you everybody’s gets exactly what you planned on and everything. And there’s I think it’s less drama for the families. Yeah, and less stress for sure.

ATTILIO:
Trust equals less drama. So for Amphay, speak to that. I know, this is up in the mainland too. And so you’re gonna you’re licensed here in the state of Hawaii, but in general, the 80% is generic to the whole United States. What would be your advice or comments on that Amphay? Will versus trust? Yeah,

AMPHAY: 
exactly what said Auntie Myra, it is important for your mom to really look at, you know, doing her estate plan. I keep saying a state plan because it is it involves a trust and you know, a will is actually a part of your estate planning because there are certain things that a will will do that a trust is unable to do so. They are complementary. Of course, the main part of the planning is the trust and you’re right by having a trust or properly designed trust, it will avoid, you know, the issues that come when it goes to probate and probate is not the place that you want to have your affairs, your private affairs because it will no longer be private. So, yeah,

ADRIENNE: 
and then also Amphay, I know we’ve talked about this the the cost of probate versus just having that that trust and that estate plan. Can you speak to that? How much does that generally run to go through probate.

AMPHAY: 
So we think about this, like a simple you know, simple probate and I say simple, it’s an you know, simple use the starts off simple. And then it becomes complicated later on, because you’re basically opening up Pandora’s box to all these issues. And so simple, meaning they have a property, it’s uncontested, you’re gonna have a blended family, for siblings or get along with Brian, probably about $5,000, you know, to do a probate, the time that it takes, again, is going to be about nine months to a year, sometimes longer. You know, I’m working with a family now, it’s been seven years in the probate, and it’s just awful. Then during this time, your family waits your beneficiaries Wait, imagine if you had dependents or a loved one that are special needs, or a minor that asked the you know, or the family that needs these resources, then it will be tied up in the probate process. So you know, at all avoidable, like I said, all avoidable by just going let me do a sit down, and then do my planning.

ATTILIO: 
Know, if your heirs and your descendants are all rotten, then just, you know, die with nothing and let them figure it out.

ADRIENNE: 
But you love them. You can or you can just give it to the Cat Sanctuary. That’s

ATTILIO: 
it. Yeah. To your favorite nonprofit? Yes. And I know you’ll talk about it on another show, because it’s a whole another topic, but I forgot what you call it. What did you call an Amphay the thing where you can leave it?

ADRIENNE: 
Charitable?

AMPHAY: 
charitable remainder trust. But

ATTILIO: 
that is like a whole one hour show. So we’re just teasing you with that chat a little bit later. That’s for later next show. But back to I Amphay, like how you we keep saying trusts and wills. But that’s a small part of the estate planning. Talk more about estate planning, because mommy OB is gonna listen to the show.

AMPHAY: 
So I think of it like this part, this is, you know, I’ve said a million times. And, you know, this is an exercise in your liberties. And you know, when you think about our liberties, we think about our privacy, we think about our health, our wealth, and our personal affairs, right? And you go in an estate plan, you we cover all of those bases, where you now have control, you decide, you decide regarding happens to your hard earned wealth that you’ve accumulated, that you want to leave for your heirs. You decide, you know, who makes this how you make decisions, who makes decisions, and even when you look at your health, you know, things like your Advanced Health Care Directive. This is my personal soapbox, I’ve never shared with you Attilio and Adrienne about, you know, really taking that personal responsibility for me, I feel every single person should never leave the burden of having to make decisions to their families or their children. Because it will break families forever. Yeah, to decide whether or not you know, Mom was now on life support, when to turn that off. And when there’s a disagreement, you know, then it becomes somebody you know, and to carry that burden to second guessed to think about EGL it’s just horrendous and I in my experience in my office I’ve seen way too many families forever broken because we didn’t address this you know Advance Health Care Directive

ATTILIO: 
meeting I met with Amphay and I’ve written into my health care directive is relatives that are not in my will please keep them away from my oxygen line because they might step on it by accident but it’s it’s to bring levity to a situation that is heartbreaking because I’ve experienced it when family and you know, they start all we want mom’s wedding ring. And then it wasn’t she didn’t clearly spell out what was to happen with mom’s wedding ring and then siblings were arguing and you can cut those things up and separate them and divide them into pieces. says so talk more about the different parts that people don’t realize there. Adrienne, you had a question? Well,

ADRIENNE: 
I wanted to, um, to get a move on over to the special need for Yeah, the special needs planning, because I know that there’s a lot of families that have special needs children.

ATTILIO: 
I have family members, I have people that are related to me. Special Needs,

ADRIENNE: 
they gotta, they gotta meet with Amphay.

ATTILIO: 
So here’s the scenario, Amphay, and I know that you see this over and over again. We will have use my

AMPHAY: 
family. Okay, go ahead. Why this it’s personal to me is because my sister is special needs.

ADRIENNE: 
Oh, okay.

AMPHAY: 
So was amazing woman. She’s the longest tenured. I don’t know what they would call them now. While she’s been working at Safeway since she graduated from high school. Oh, wow. in there for 25 years. So the kudos to Safeway. Is this what do you just call that before? advertisement? Yeah,

ATTILIO: 
the show is brought to you by Safeway. Bringing you groceries one day at a time. So what’s her name?

ADRIENNE: 
Give her a shout out.

AMPHAY: 
Rosie.

ATTILIO: 
Rosie, what Safeway she work at? Waimalu? Hey, say hi to Rosie. Waimalu Safeway she’s famous now. Okay, go ahead, keep going.

AMPHAY: 
You know, and part of the this planning is really well, it’s two parts. And why it’s important is because the unintended consequences in the event that that families don’t plan. Yeah, the first thing and what makes important is the services that your special needs, loved ones have been participating or receiving, yes, in the event that you don’t plan K, they now see, get an inheritance because the person had passed away their parents had passed away without being a planning that child especially child will receive whatever they’re entitled to, there’s no way around it, once they receive it, that they’re going to be ineligible, because the acids that they own are going to exceed, what is the amount which is $3,000. I’m just rounding it off. Oh,

ADRIENNE: 
wow. That’s a little

AMPHAY: 
difficult. It’s so difficult to get back on. So now if they’re receiving Medicaid, Medicaid services, now they are no longer eligible for that. They have to spend down those funds, okay, which again, is to me waste meaning using money that you don’t necessarily need to use. Right. So it’s to protect and assure that they will be eligible for public benefits. And you’re talking about housing, you talking about medical services talking about? So there’s a

ATTILIO: 
lot of tension. Yep.

AMPHAY: 
So security, disabilities, SSI. And the second and more importantly, is that you want to also assure the quality of life for your special needs loved ones, yes. They already have a lot of challenges. You know, and they probably need the most help of all your children because of you know, the situation and the things that they have to deal with on a daily basis. And I go now, what does that mean? What that means is really assuring that there is a resource available for things that bring joy and happiness to their life. Yeah.

ATTILIO: 
Yeah, I think it’s important. Critical did because I have special needs, friends and relatives, and the parents or the caregivers are filling in probably 70 80%, depending on where they’re at, of the life, things that happen. And then they’re operating, if they’re functioning out in the real world are not in a very narrow window of what they’re doing. And when the when the caregiver or the loved one is gone. And there’s no one there’s no specific instructions or anything and even like what you said, all of those things are filling in to allow this person to be a functioning part of the community. And it’s, Hey, Hey, John, I pay a lot of taxes. I want my tax dollars going to these programs supporting these people, and having you providing them a solution where that continues. for mom and dad go on so and

ADRIENNE: 
fee if the family doesn’t own property. I know that sometimes that’s a misconception thinking, oh, like I don’t need to get my trust because I don’t, you know, don’t own property. Like how important or like, what’s that? What’s that myth about? You know, getting the Yeah, with with the special needs specifically? Yes.

AMPHAY: 
Yes, there are other things as well. Let’s see. Let’s talk about retirement accounts. Yes. Right. Well, there’s are investments or businesses so All of these things kind of come into play. So yes, for most of us, you know, our homes are the biggest assets that we have that we want to pass on to our children. Yet there are other assets as well. So whatever those assets are, they are going to be comfortable assets that make it eligible. Aside from that, and that, you know, like the most common mistakes I see for families that have loved ones that are special needs is yes, they go, Okay, we’re not going to leave it for that child that has special needs. And we’re going to leave it to the other sibling, and the other sibling will be able to take care of their special needs child. Yeah. And I go, don’t do that. That is probably the worst thing that you can do is exclude that special needs child who actually needs it the most. What you want is a surety, that says this child will always be provided for Yes, right. So regardless, if you have a home or not, like well, you have other assets, and you can even fund a special needs trust are ready to make sure that it passed all of the tests the requirements, and have a bucket. And that’s the peace of mind part agent really to say, you know, if I’m not here to take care of my sister, do I have something already set up? And then that that thing that is set up? Is it properly funded? Yeah, if it’s properly funded, does it meet all of the tests so that way, I never jeopardize you know, what services that she needs. So I got very important,

ATTILIO: 
you know, people don’t think they have assets. But I just remember what Bradley from Allstate was fairly take your house, flip it upside down and shake it. And all the things fall out that that are worth a lot of money. I mean, I don’t know. I mean, these Pokemon cards, you know, there’s Pokemon cards that are $15,000. And, and I’m joking, and I’m not. And so if you give that to the other sibling when I think there’s good intentions there, but I don’t think that the logic of it or what you’re saying, just tell us again, what that word means. assurity

AMPHAY: 
Yeah, for sure. Assurance, you know, you want to be sure, right, like almost like a guarantee, then this will be used to provide for you because the other issue is that now if you leave it to the other sibling, and see that now it’s going through a divorce is being sued Oh, people money house in foreclosure, whatever life situation for the other siblings, if they receive those funds, those funds are going to be subject to their current situation. Yeah. So there is no guarantees that your loved one that actually needs it the most. That is special needs. We want to receive any of it not even a penny. Yeah.

ADRIENNE: 
Well, Amphay it sounds like you know, you have a wealth of knowledge with the situation, you know, specifically, you know, just going through your life with your sister. And I just want to encourage any families out there that do have special needs children to give. And so how does that look? If anyone were to reach out for that initial consultation? Do they come to your office? You could have them how does that work? How does it work?

AMPHAY: 
Whatever works best for my families they wanted to share with you Attilio you know, you thought about being an MSW first and then going to law school yeah, I go we are a rare breed I say that because I have a handful of friends that are social workers are attorneys as well yes and I go Why are rare breed is exactly what I wanted to say about you know, the services that you know, my firm for all me specifically provide where I actually will go out to the families it’s really you know, what is going to be most convenient for them. Some families want to come to my office because they want to be sure I have an office

ATTILIO: 48:56
they want to poke you in the shoulder

ADRIENNE: 9
Yeah, you know

ATTILIO: 
Amphay correct me if I’m wrong. You help families out of islands to correct

AMPHAY: 
yes, yeah, I go once a month to each island except for Niihau and Kahoolawe Of course

ATTILIO: 
for Kahoolawe is only if you setting up a trust for a bomb craters. Niihau you have to speak special language of Hawaiian and be invited. Yeah. The Yeah.

ADRIENNE: 
So so you’ll go to them, they can come to you. How does that initial consult look look like?

AMPHAY: 
There is no obligation. Okay. You know, our firm prides ourselves in educating our families really want them to know what it is that they’re doing when they’re doing a state plan. So that way, at the end of the day, we understand you know, what it is that we put into this binder with 400 something pages, like what it is that they just created, you know, When we see you’re creating peace of mind for your family. And Adrienne, I personally enjoy consultation is that you clean it down.

ATTILIO: 
Yeah. Yeah. And and what I say is that you run your business just like us. It’s educate first business second. And if we don’t move to the second point, which is business, that’s fine. As long as we educated you and I listened to a philosophize, this podcast and the tagline is, do I know more today than I did yesterday? And I think that’s what you’re helping these families do is avoid all the heartache. Because it’s it’s tough dealing with all that details when you’re in a high emotional state. Yeah.

ADRIENNE: 
Do it now.

ATTILIO: 
Do it now.

ADRIENNE: 
Yeah.

AMPHAY: 50:42
You don’t want to be in that place. You know, I just flew back from Las Vegas. And people think, Oh, you’re to Vegas. And you know, sadly, I went because my cousin is really, really sick. You know? Yeah. And it was very difficult to bring up about estate planning. You know, like, very,

ATTILIO: 
nobody wants to talk. Well, that was, yeah,

AMPHAY: 
I’m sorry. Nobody

ATTILIO: 
wants to talk about it in that moment there. You know, it’s, uh, yeah, to celebrate life. And the last thing you want to be figuring out is who’s paying for that? Who’s gonna get this? And

ADRIENNE: 
Amphay, were you able to get his trust put together with your trip?

AMPHAY: 
And it was where it was tough. Because I think all the emotions, I mean, there’s so much stress and pressure on the entire family. Yeah. You know, and then, you know, the reality is, this is a hard conversation to be had. It’s sucks that it is being done right now in this situation. versus us. You know, like, I when I sat with you, Adrienne, when I sat with you Attilio, to really, you know, be proactive. I mean, it’s a different environment. And

ATTILIO: 
your body is in a different state when you’re putting this together now versus on your deathbed. Exactly. So do it now, folks. That’s the takeaway. That’s your lesson for today. Don’t put your relatives in this position at a time when they just want to celebrate your life. Yeah, that’s it.

ADRIENNE: 
All right. And Amphay we are coming to the end of the show, and just wanted to thank you so much for once again, being our guests and

ATTILIO: 
you will be on again because so much to talk about. You know what we need to remind people of this. We’ll have you on often. Thanks so much, and thank you.

AMPHAY: 
Thank you, Adrienne. Thank you, Attilio. Thank you, Auntie Myra.

MYRA: 
For some good information already.

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